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Thursday, May 25, 2006 

Reservation-Haunts Again(More teeth added) -I

Again Reservation!


Warning:!
I request everybody to read this mail from a comman perspective. And request everybody to shun away their caste Identity. Still vast majority of people are toiling in villages suffering two pronged devils 1) Caste oppression and 2) Economic depression. And lower caste people(poor and slum) in urban area also still suffering social discrimination in either way(economic and/or Caste). Given this context inorder to give even opportunity to everybody, reservation is the only option available in this system. The other option could be to demolish the system.


+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Some arguments and Counter arguments:


#1) One of the prime argument by the Social oppressors is "Fair Competition"


This argument is primarily the argument of Neo Globalisation Middle class who benifitted from the sufferrings of Amrican Employees. This Argument is valid against Upper caste, as in IT field they are representing more than 60%.


What is fair competition?

Is that the one we compete with American employees? Will any one us can survive if we have to have a fair competition with american counter part who lost job because of Outsourcing? If those upper caste elites are sooooooo honest and dedicated to fair competition then apply it to themself when they compete with USA employees. Atleast Do they have the courage to accept that not becasue of talent but becasue of Cheap labour that made the USA counter part loose the Fair competition with India and other countries? Those people shouldn't talk about Fair competition with this great immorality with in them.


#2) The other argument is Economically good - other caste people are enjoying Reservation. This argument has its base on the ignorance of the truth that Reservation are not based on Caste but based on population. Reservation not based on Caste, Based on population:


Reservation are given not based on caste. It is introduced to even the uneven sharing of lucurative, influential jobs by various social groups. The percentage of upper caste in total population is around 5%(tamil nadu statistics). Where as they occupy the whole lot of positions in All good-coloured collar jobs(white etc).

The reservation is the same as reservation for Afro-American' in USA(all the companies- regarless of private or public). Unfortunately(Fortunate for some section) the social groups in India are Caste groups too.

The existing reservation is implimented paritaly. Till most of the Good-colored collar jobs are in the hands of uppercaste. However there is no attempt from government to even the uneven sharing of jobs in Bad-colored collar jobs(Lavatory cleaning etc).

While the upper caste person can become a temple archagar for a lower caste God. Govt, Supreme court, and other judicial bodies are banning a lower caste person become a archagar for an upper caste temple. is that a fair competition?

My opinion from the available statistics and from what I perceive everday is that the reservation should be more than 90% for other than upper caste social groups. And it should be compensatory reservation system.


That is for example if the reservation for a particular caste group is not filled in the bad-colored collar jobs then the reservation for the particular group should be reduced in good-colored collar jobs. (If it hurts somebody then they have to understand that the cricket mail hurts the oppressed people....Sarcastical approach is not a sole property belongs upper caste).


#3) There are people who say increase allocation to education instead of reservation which would help the socialy discriminated castes:


These people never ever lend their Voice for the solution they say. Till now, those social oppressors are struggling just to anihilate reservation. For those people: If their concern about India is Genuine, then they have to first join the struggle for Education&Employment to everybody. If it is implimented then they have the justification to struggle against reservation.


#4) Quality and Merit:


Latest cut-off marks for BCs and SC/STs in Tamil nadu professional -Entrance Exams for MBBS admission - Analyst, Jayaprakash Gandhi of Salem, notes that last year the cut off scores for MBBS entrance in the government colleges were (including the TNPCEE scores) - OC-295.74; BC -294.26; MBC-292.13; SC-287.56; and ST-274.00. Is the score 287.56 out of 300 is poor score and the SC people are idiots?
And there is no untoward incidents in India in any field that happened particularly due to poor quality Lower caste person.

Indeed there are majority of ugly incidents involving only upper caste people, starting from India' first Centeral minister sacked for corruption T.Krishnamachary to Stock exchange scam Harshadh Medha. And we have examples where low caste people went to villages to serve their people.


Let's see the below statistics which contradict the share of various social groups in population:


IPS Total => 3300, Upper caste(Brahmin) ==> 2376 ----- 72%

Ministry of Defence(Class I) Total==> 1397, Upper caste(Brahmin) ==> 1332----96%

Ministry of Defence(Class II) Total==> 7752, Upper caste(Brahmin) ==> 6762----87%

Ministry of Defence(Class III) Total==> 2127, Upper caste(Brahmin) ==> 1332----62%

And this is because of the fact that still vast majority of people are toiling in villages suffering two pronged devils 1) Caste oppression and 2) Economic depression. And lower caste people(poor and slum) in urban area(especially- Mid towns) also still uffering social discrimination in either way(economic and/or Caste).

Given this context inorder to give even opportunity to everybody, reservation is the only option available in this system. Inorder to distribute the available resources evenly, the other option could be 'Demolish this system - Revolution'.

Which one will You Choose?


Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting

This cartoon I got forwarded to my Mail from my friend. Sometime before Indian Express published a cartoon ridiculing SBI strike. Now while the upper class elite are striking against the right of oppressed people, Indian Express supporting them. This is the real face of Indian Express always against right of the people. The SBI cartoon is modifed to expose the Anti reservation strike by junior Doctors.


Dear Friends, As we enter the next chapter in the issues concerning reservations, let call a spade a spade and accept that reservations are here to stay. We must now focus our energies in trying to understand what are the important considerations at hand, what are the fears and insecurities of the youth and students and I think the problem is many fold: i.) The only afforable means of education available to those who come from average middle class, lower middle and the economically disadvantage only have one choice and that is of government colleges. Even if one did schooling from a private school, the extremely high fees for higher technical and medical education is largely outside the reach of a vast majority of us. MSRIT Bangalore charges a minimum of 1.8 lakh per year for its MBBS course, this is for day scholars, now not many among us can afford this and even if we could afford, it is not as if there are seats for everyone. (not to forget that thousands of private capitation colleges are run by politicians like Ramadoss who have built up their empires subsided by our taxes) ii. ) Reservations are a fait accompli and there is nothing anyone can do in India which will cause the parliament to roll back, neither the courts or any form of agitation, because the party which rolls back from this current stand will only do so if it wants to committ political suicide. iii) How can we ensure that the general category students do not suffer? The government has given an assurance that the general category students will not suffer and it will provide additional seats for them to compensate the 27% increase. iv. ) As has been the general trend of the political parties and of the government adminstrators, their record in implementing their own policies has been extremly erratic, lopsided and inadequate. Once again the government and its implementation agencies will sit on their fat backsides and do nothing. But there is another way v.) Now students have to wake up to the fact that to ensure that the government does not go back on its committments it has made regarding reservations, ALL STUDENTS AND YOUTH WILL HAVE TO UNITE. If the OBC feel complacent that they will anyway get their reserved quota seats, then they are sadly mistaken and will fall into the trap which the ST SC students fell years ago. Because the ST SC did not make a consistent, concerted effort at pushing the government to implement their 22% quota a sizeable section of their seats and posts have still not been filled. Similarly the General Category students will have to feep their eyes and ears open to ensure that they are not being short changed.However the General Category students will not manage to achieve this on their own either, they will need the support of others. Eventually the only way this entire process can come to any positive advantage to all sections of the youth and students is by foregoing all castesist (pro- anti) prejudices and joining hands in fighting to secure each others and your own rights. At the same time students and youth must also unite to fight against the privatisation of education and to force the government to invest much more in eucation and make many more affordable schools and colleges for everyone. STUDENTS OF THE WORLD UNITE YOU HAVE NOTHING TO LOOSE BUT LOTS TO CHANGE

WHY THE MERIT ARGUMENT DOES NOT WORK: Other than the fact that "merit" like any skill is an acquired attribute dependent on social background, economic status which enables better and more focused education opportunities, private tutions or expensive coaching classes, all of which contribute significantly to create a person of merit. There is also an added aspect to "merit", taking in to account that about 3 lakh students sit for the entrance exam or technical and medical colleges, where as there are only seats for around 12000 in government institutions such as IITs and AIIMS etc.; so does the passing of an exam or just the ability to score marks and admission into any of these colleges the definitive test of merit, are the remaning 2.88 lakh students to be counted as belonging to a largely un-meritorious section of society? Please dont reply, that do I want ALL of them to become docs or engineers? Taking marks and % as a criterio, is it not true that today the gap between the ST SC candidate and a general category has largely leveled out and are at a good competetive level anyway. Taking AIIMS as an example: minimum % for general category is 60% for St SC 55% AS THE BASIC MINIMUM MARKS REQUIRED TO APPLY and eventually the ST SC student who has scored NOT LESS THAN 87% gets admission. So it is not as if the reserved quota seats are going to someone with lower than 40% as many among YFE have tried to misrepresent. I think I am in fairly safe hands if the doctor has scored above 55% forget 87%. In most foriegn countries like Germany and even in the US, to have PASSED MBBS is considered adequate to go in for further studies and he/she is not required to give any additional exams as a pre requisite to apply for MS MD courses. Similarly any doctor going in for MD MS or higer in lets say AIIMS has to minimum pass MBBS with a 55% and the MD MS also has to be passed within TWO chances irrespective of their QUOTA or category.

Welcome Mr. Kadampa,

I read your second posting. Yet to read your first posting.

I am impressed by your logical and analytical argument style.

I accpet that still SC/ST people are denyed of any basic rights, while the social oppressers are talking about Merit, and Anti reservation.

And in India these social oppressors are talking about privatising education system to improve the under privillaged sections of the soceity. I have a doupt whether they eat shit.

There even various reports from the ruling section(MP, MLA) that the present globalisation and privatisation process has develpoed the gap between rural and uraban and rich and the poor.

And we should remember that reservation is not the final solution to the problems of under privillaged or non provillaged vast majority of people.

What is your choice?

A reservation or A revolution?

I am a brahmin. I have some common sense to understand that there exist only two caste being rich and poor. What matter to me if TVS or Hindu is rich. In fact i know all the daughter are married to non brahmin and non hindu rich people.

We were family of five and myself and my younger sister was assisted by the elder three. Both are outside the country and we assist my elder children to come up in life in assisting in eduction with funds. That is all. and also i try to help poor and needy for education and medicine

Why cannot the people who had availed the benefits get out of the reservation and asisst others. Once every body agrees to remove the creamy layer, reservation will be a relative. Actully the pro reservatin people are the lazy fellow you have come up and wants to enjoy the benefit and would not want that to go lesser brethens who wants reservatino purely on caste rather than with economic criteria. Let some pro reservation guys who belongs to creamy layer has the guts to talk it out

My dear hardworking Brahmin,

You don't have comman sense when you say there exists only Rich and Poor in India. Indeed the dimenson of Economy mingling with caste giving something more than the two you have said.

I request you to read the article and respond... Don't let your half baked agenda broken throuth half way exposing your non harworking Nature :-))

And I request you better not arguing here with your Yuppy mentality, that is - you are hard working and those who in Rural and Caste backwards asking reservation are lazzy.

The worst kind of perversion and argonce is this, your Yuppy mentality...


Asuran/Bonapert

Hi,

If u have spine why donot u answer the question of creamy among back ward classes not eligible for reservation. do u have the guts to state that i donot want reservation for me who have to this level as there are many of my brethren who has not reached this level.

Rather i feel you are one among the first to come up who does not want anybody to disturb ur free lunch be a parasite on the society.

Government took away lands as 60 40. Brahmin moved 40 years back without anything in hand. My generation growth is outcome of the sacrifice of one generation's hard work against all kinds of prejudices by government and politicians. Only by sheer hard work.

when u donut even know how many people are backward and who are backward you want a reservation to promote another type of free lunch / parasite on the society

What is the value of your work in the market and how much of your value u have shared with the society / country.

Your response sound u too be incompetent perverse who does not have the spine to hard work strive and come up

Why cannot people do degree by postal. Why cannot people do profession like CA where there is no entrance limit. Buddy u will not understand as you are brain washed if any to say down down rather than grow/ grow.

Even if u go UP, you will have a reservation for the poor brahmin by mayawati whether you like it or not

1. Reservation by cast.

If u ask for caste then i can assure u the developed among the caste will eat your reservation and will keep the caste people as poor. Naryanan president children got benefit and become IFS office and they will do for eternity and will not allow anybody to come inside to take the benefit.

Result : Rich reserved people will stay are rich and poor be poor

b. reservation for poor

suggestion which does not go into the thick heads of yours is the reservation for needy and poor.

Result : some poor from upper caste also will get benefit.

A fool, Don;t you see what I have clearly mentioned in the post.

The reservation is not the solution. But those who protesting reservation are not good ones.

And If you are so desperate to do something to makeup this Caste divide with in this system, With out demolishing this system then reservation is the only option....

And If you say creamy layer of the OBC or SC/ST will only benifit by reservation, yes it is true. But atleast as a community OBC and SC/ST will have their share of representation. And if you look at my post I have clearly mentioned it is the representation of Community that is the baseline for reservation - not caste. I know that is the scope of reservation. That is why I mention revolution as real solution

But if reservation is not there what happens?

Only Brahmin and Upper caste people will decorate the chairs (as it is in IT and other private companies).

if you are so concerned about poors come and struggle for the real liberation of the mass - A revolution.

Otherwise try to live with this reservation and wait for the mass doing revolution in near future.

Don't shed your crocodile Tears here.

We know history and We see what is happening in Each and Every Castes. Don't lie that Brahmins are the one suffered a Lot(Ofcourese there exists poor Brahmins). And we know why brahmins left country side and settled in Cities. Or try to write a history book with this your lies on Brahmins.

When started having your outlook from your enclosed Villa you miss the Socio economic Disparity of India.

//Government took away lands as 60 40. Brahmin moved 40 years back without anything in hand. My generation growth is outcome of the sacrifice of one generation's hard work against all kinds of prejudices by government and politicians. Only by sheer hard work.//

This above lines show your arrogancy and Caste pride. Don't come here with this inhumane attitude or otherwies you would suffer a Worst kind of treatement.

When most of Govt posts and Media and Business establishments are controled by Brahmin and Upper caste people and there are always people to guide these brahmin and Upper caste childrens(regardless of he is poor or rich), Why cannot yuo achive. and wherever yuo go you show your caste arrogance.

How many of Indians Aware CA and other stuffs? How many of other Backward castes have the previlage to get guidance about all this?

With all this socio economic Privilages Brahmins and Upper caste are surviving and Still you say that you survived because of your hardwork(I didn't deny hardworking. Indeed most of us working hard atleast in their opinion. But it is the yield that counts. And that is where Brahmins and Upper castes leverage on Indian Condition come in to existence).

First Shed away the social stigma of your Brahmin caste.

There is Wide divide between Rural and Urban

There is Wide divide Between Castes

And You like to see what is favourable to you.

If you still like to belive and Make others belive that mayawathi represents Dalits and Other downtrodden people, Then I Should say I am realy amused to see your political immaturity.

*************

resevation will not even the uneven economic condition, Indeed it is to even the uneven share of benifits with in this uneven economic condition. so reservation based on Economic condition is in real term a farse and no where in the world it exists. Don't try to fool us....

Come out of yuor Brahmin Musings

Asuran

Hi,

Hypocrat u donot have spines to publish what i write.

A Bullshit eating Monkey... Just read the article fully and then Vomit here. Regarding your merit argument the article itself answers with statistics. And I again answered. You moron don't have brain to read anything but still beleive you are in good position because of your hard work....

I wonder how the hell a person with the incapability to read and understand a few line article and respond with logical argument can able to believe he has talent..... It's a real bullshit irony... :-)))

Asuran

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